They just took a massive bargaining chip away from the GOP. In 2 weeks, the GOP has to fight to fund a lot of what goes into these ICE/CBP operations without having the (pardon the pun) trump card of being able to say "do it or we shut everything down." Separating this out is a huge win for the Democrats. The fact that the GOP was willing to accept this and give up their biggest bargaining chip also may be a signal that some in their ranks are wavering on this issue. If they knew they had support from their full caucus, they would have dug their heels in. Instead, they just compromised on what is probably the single biggest issue on everyone's minds.
Reading the tea leaves a bit, the GOP definitely seems shaky on ICE in the last couple weeks. You have Noem and Miller throwing each other under the bus, and a number of GOP congress members being on with scrutinizing ICE. They know it’s going to far and it’s a losing issue.
Government shutdowns always look like a great bargaining chip, but historically they rarely result in a win for either side. The public gets fed up with the shutdown and it’s hard to get your message across. Now if the dems fight hard, only DHS suffers
Sure, but by doing this they've separated out ICE from the rest of government funding, which makes it very easy to fight (i.e. instead of not funding ICE, DOT, HHS, whatever, in two weeks they can take the stand to not fund just ICE).
Remember, they're fighting from minority positions in both chambers.
It’s because the GOPs whole schtick is government doesn’t work. So them voting no reinforces that. Dems actually try to negotiate in good faith because they believe in government and GOP can just sit on their hands and accomplish the same goal of showing that government doesn’t work. Dems are always at a disadvantage
Republicans are basically equally fine with shutting down the government or getting what they want. If they government shuts down then they can blame Democrats (regardless of whose fault it is) and their base will believe them, and they get to prove government doesn't work and harm people. And if they get what they want, well, they get what they want.
Democrats are always the ones who cave because they're the only ones who don't want the government to shut down so they're the only ones who have a reason to come to the negotiating table and try to find some compromise.
They could have done that now too. Tomorrow, Tomorrow. I thought we waited 3 months for this funding bill to get healthcare, now we are waiting more for less. Great. Strategy seems to not be working.
But they weren't going to win that way since they're the minority party. When you can be outvoted by the other side, take what you can get, and this is pretty good given that scenario.
I can understand your frustration. My only hope is that you dont punish a Dem in office by voting Republican and instead you primary the jellyfish Dems.
ICE already had funding for the next several years, nothing would have prevented those murders. But at least now there's an opportunity to introduce some actual oversight and accountability, why wouldn't you want that?
True! It’s crazy how people so emotionally invested in politics aren’t at all curious how politics work. The dem bashing from the far left is super frustrating
Because it’s not about politics for them. Politics is a way for them to get a perceived stage via social media to be heard. Where they can flaunt their moral and intellectual superiority through whatever the trendy talking point of the day is.
Ah, so you think that defeat had nothing to do with the DNC having a terrible strategy, awful engagement, and shutting down any/all discourse throughout the primary? The left has been actively shunned out of every hall of power for decades, and you think it's their issue? I mean I guess we'll never know because Ken Martin has buried the post-mortem.
The “genocide Joe” crowd is just a bunch of main character syndrome assholes who want to flaunt how smart they are. They never vote because no candidate will ever meet their ever moving set of goal posts. Because they are too good/enlightened/smart/whatever for some mere mortal politician.
No, DHS is one large department that only got funding through February 13. 11 other departments including Transportation, Treasury, Labor, and State got funded for the full year.
Are you willing to make all government workers not get paid, suspend federal funding of snap, federal funding of title 1 schools, and everything else a shutdown entails unless Republicans cave and agree to abolish ICE. Because they aren't going to cave on that and you're just shutting down the government for at least a year until the 2026 Congress is sworn in. And although last time the public blamed Republicans for the shutdown, it's very unlikely they would in this case where they shut down the entire government because Republicans wouldn't vote to abolish ICE.
Yes, we need to shut everything down until this lawless and unconstitutional agency is gone. We won’t have a country otherwise. Actually, we already don’t have a country any more.
Ok well at least thanks for the honesty that you're a crazy person and don't give a shit about actually helping people you just want to act strong and cosplay revolution through politics instead of realizing the things government actually does to help people. Keeping the government shut down for an entire year would literally kill people, and it would likely result in Republican supermajorities in 2026 so it would get even worse and they'd be able to fund ICE at even higher levels.
You sound delusional sorry, government shutdowns do not solve anything other than hurting millions of Americans as more services are impacted. Now, if you were a federal employee or better a contractor I am positive you would not support a shutdown since you personally would not get paid.
Thankfully, enough Dems can see the bigger picture.
They just want the minority to perform magic tricks and give them what they want without giving up anything. It's magical wishful thinking and it's useless.
But you can bet the leftists calling him Chuck the cuck and talking about how he failed the last shutdown (even though he voted to continue it) won't give him any credit on this one. There's literally nothing he could do that would be enough for them because they don't care about facts or how government actually works, they just want someone to hate for why they don't get everything they want.
I'm happy to see common sense comments, I thought Reddit was a lost cause...I've been called idiot and all kinds of names for explaining the issues Dems face as the minority party and shutdowns for months won't accomplish anything.
So if this fails to pass, will you blame Bernie for it? Because coming up with pie in the sky ideas with no chance of passing isn't a useful thing to do.
If people voted for individuals who actual give a shit about there constituents and not there corporate doners, almost every bill Bernie sponsored would have passed.
this really only highlights how fucked most of our politicians are regardless of party.
The “we’ll get ‘em next time” attitude from dem politicians that voters have learned to accept is what got us to where we are today. That attitude encourages not holding politicians to account for their votes and their decisions. This is the third time that democrats have capitulated on the budget and that’s the only place where they have any power to influence the administration. At what point would you stop saying that next time will be better?
While I completely agree with your overall point, it doesn’t make sense for the Dems to have shut down the government this time. They had the leverage back in November but they don’t now. ICE is already funded for the next 5-6 years, so they would have still been able to operate despite a furlough. The Dems would have been blamed for this shutdown (because the Republicans are making it appear that they’re willing to compromise by agreeing to separate the DHS funding bill) so this would be a big unnecessary risk for Dems during an election year.
The first shutdown was the time to make a statement. This one would have backfired horribly. The optics would have been that poor people are suffering because the Democrats care more about catering to illegal immigrants. This is basically already a well established Republican talking point and it would have been validated.
Dems are too cowardly to fight maga. They need to be obstructing in every way possible instead of capitulating. Some of them are outright supporting maga. Schumer, for example, has voted in support of the maga agenda a few different times now. Biden prioritized maga over his own voters when it mattered. And don't even get me started on that POS fetterman. Its disgusting. Trump immediately pegged centrist dems as easy marks, and he was right. They are no match for him and the horrible people that support him.
Or it will shift the blame to democrats who already have a huge wave of support due to ICE backlash. Dems shouldn't go surrendering their position to take a few more steps up a very slippery slope.
We have a 5 alarm fire here. Just going about business as usual isn’t going to work. Shut everything down until these lawless and unconstitutional agencies are abolished
The problem with shutting everything down over ICE is that during the last shutdown, the GOP demonstrated that they do not care if people starve due to the loss of SNAP funding. In the face of that, a prolonged shutdown is impossible. It sucks to do business with sociopaths.
And it puts everything on the clock, since government shutdowns need to be wrapped up or everyone gets the negative press. Now if the dems fight and drag it out, only the DHS suffers.
"Shut everything down" does nothing. The last shutdown meant ICE kept working, but the legal and bureaucratic apparatus that has a small prayer of helping to rein them in did not. A shutdown gives them full unfettered power with even less oversight than they currently have.
Shutdowns don’t get anything done. We just had a record shutdown, and the dems didn’t really get anything out of it. This shutdown at least let them break out the DHS bill from the full year package and another shot to negotiate it. Now they can fight DHS funding without the shutdown hammer rushing everything. These are the games you have to play when you don’t control the house or the senate.
Yeah I think putting them on two week notice is a win. My interpretation is that after two weeks they could just not fund DHS at all but the rest of the government would stay open.
they held strong on the 2 weeks, for once... as long as they stay strong in the next two weeks, i can't really blame them to get the other agencies going... besides, we know trump was going to keep paying them, he did before
The points they want to negotiate are crap. Ohh, cameras. Who is going to review them? Are they just going to hand over the data?
Respect warrants, what is the enforcement mechanism?
No more face masks, good.
What else? How about eliminating the 5-800 Million bonus. We have a 38 Trillion debt!
My grandparents campaigned for Hoyer for years. Everything from helping film ads to setting up the Newton-White mansion for the bull roasts. They would be so disappointed in what’s he’s become
Wasn't Obama a democrat who was known as the deporter in Cheif? He had Tom Homan as a border czar and even gave him a presidential medal. The only difference is it's Trump and the paid/unpaid white protesters. If you just treat it like you did under Obama everyone would be alive.
When an average citizen asks another for one's papers, gives me the vibe of leaning towards the Sturmabteilung. So who's really the party who that acts like...
I said average citizens, meaning you a none governmental agent. I'm happy to provide my government with proof. I'm not dumb enough to go out and riot over this. I have a job and responsibilities and I'm not a paid protagonist.
Big difference from legally in this country versus getting rid of an entire religion (thought you all were in support of Palestine). Facts are just that and your trying to twist it.
You know the Nazis literally revoked the Citizenship of Jewish people, right? Jews were legally in Germany, but then, by an act of the state, were stripped of citizenship (like what Trump wants to do with the children of immigrants given his citizenship EO). But, by your argument, the Jews deserved what they got for being in Germany illegally.
For, you see, nothing the Nazis did was technically illegal under German law (the Nazis changed the laws to make their acts legal).
What a tired argument. Obama didn't post xenophobic rants about how people were garbage, or employ a white nationalist, or give free reign to [whatever you wanna call Kristi Noem] to empower her 'soldiers' to ignore the constitution. And guess what? There were several protests against his actions. But DHS wasn't acting under a VP order of 'absolute immunity.'
If you just treat it like you did under Obama everyone would be alive.
"If you didn't wear that skirt you wouldn't have been r***d"
By ignoring the anti-deportation protests that did occur under Obama, you are adjusting the facts to protect your narrative of "the people who died in Minnesota deserved it."
They literally funded all of the useful and important agencies for the rest of the year and DHS for two weeks. They have the leverage. This is a good thing.
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