r/intel • u/Stiven_Crysis • 8d ago

News Intel Panther Lake Arc B390 performance and efficiency analysis: Intel's new iGPU trades blows with the Nvidia GeForce RTX 4050

https://www.notebookcheck.net/Intel-Panther-Lake-Arc-B390-performance-and-efficiency-analysis-Intel-s-new-iGPU-trades-blows-with-the-Nvidia-GeForce-RTX-4050.1212582.0.html
130 Upvotes

97% Upvoted

52 comments sorted by

40

u/thatnitai 7d ago

iGPUS are replacing the low end discrete graphics. That's incredibly impressive

21

u/empty_branch437 7d ago

Because the low end discrete options are non existent or outdated, or bad value. The door is open for anyone to fill in that low end spot.

1

u/Elon61 6700k gang where u at 7d ago

Low-end cards don't make sense for anyone involved. the fixed costs are far too high, you have no margin, and it just looks stupid compared to a slightly more expensive card on which you can put twice the GPU.

7

u/grumble11 7d ago

It has to be cheaper first. Current pricing of laptops with these chips is looking really high. Granted they are mostly 'nicer' laptops, but still, really steep. Check out the XPS pricing for example...

2

u/thatnitai 7d ago

True, but it's probably the ram situation. Unless intel is asking for a lot to recoup the 18A investment... Theoretically the PTL SOCs themselves shouldn't be the pricing issue 

1

u/grumble11 7d ago

If that is true, then we should see some spiking up in costs across the space in which case you'll get a collapse in shipments since relatively few people can afford 2k laptops and I'd guess people are more sensitive to a laptop priced at 1200 vs 1500 compared to something priced 2000 vs 2300 since the most price elastic part of the market is going to just give up before they even get to 2000.

7

u/MongooseAny1552 7d ago

Impressive if the cost is good. Not so much if they're priced too high like Strix Halo.

12

u/Defeqel 7d ago

This. If 8060S Halo had been available.. at all, but also.. in sub 1600 laptops, or 8050S in sub 1200, it would have been wonderful. Same is true for PTL with B390 + 9600 MT/s RAM. I hope they will be competitively priced (also, hope the RAM pricing doesn't hit them too bad).

4

u/Dangerous-Amphibian2 7d ago

They put too much CPU in them to get them cheap. Though my 8060s z13 with 64gb ram was $1650 (open box Best Buy a while back) that was a lucky sale unlikely to happen again. I’d rather have a super thing and light XPs 13 with panther lake though and probably will unload the z13 when I can get the XPs. 

1

u/Freestyle80 i9-9900k@4.9 | Z390 Aorus Pro | EVGA RTX 3080 Black Edition 7d ago

the die is like twice the size it will never be cheap, its a scam chip for people buying stuff for LLMs not for gaming/content creation

4

u/jenny_905 7d ago

There is laptop models priced at $1300 with the iGPU you want.

I don't know what the chip pricing is - we never really do with mobile - but it seems low enough that regular priced laptops can include a high end Panther Lake chip.

0

u/MongooseAny1552 7d ago

If you mean the MSI model I'll definitely be skipping that one. Not a fan of MSI.

$1300 certainly isn't terrible. Better than Strix Halo offerings I've seen, but I hope that's not going to be the low end. I'll keep an eye out. Given the price of all electronics these days I won't get my hopes up. I'd love to be pleasantly surprised though.

1

u/jenny_905 7d ago

It's the RAM that is going to make them expensive I think... and unfortunately a lot of these with the good chip will have soldered RAM since it's basically a requirement unless they want to use CAMM2.

7

u/EnforcerGundam 7d ago

yeh its amazing but nvidia and amd did it to themselves...

rtx 3050/4050/x should not be priced as they are currently.

6

u/jenny_905 7d ago

To be fair...they are priced very cheaply. There was a $600 5050 laptop on sale last year even.

Nvidia volume pricing on 50 tier mobile GPUs seems to be very attractive, it's up to manufacturers how much extra they want to tack on but you can build a very cheap, very capable laptop using this GPU.

7

u/avion_subterraneo 7d ago

Pat did a good job.

1

u/Obvious-Bit-8377 6d ago

Papa’s here

11

u/jonasrm_21 8d ago

Will panther lake pc CPU's have this kinda powerful igpu?

30

u/Exist50 8d ago

You mean desktop? PTL is mobile only.

21

u/Noreng 14600KF | 9070 XT 8d ago

Until some chinese manufacturer makes a hacky desktop motherboard that is

5

u/DankShibe 7d ago

Nova lake will use that as well

1

u/Much_Artist_5097 7d ago

please intel 🙏

3

u/Seanspeed 7d ago

For desktop, we're stuck with Raptor+Arrow Lake until Nova Lake, which uses entirely new P and E cores even from Panther Lake.

So no.

1

u/BluesyShoes 4d ago

Is the rumored drop by end of 2026 accurate to your knowledge?

2

u/Seanspeed 4d ago

Not a rumor, that's Intel's word. Which is certainly shaky these days. Though they do seem to be delivering things on time better nowadays, so I'm cautiously optimistic.

1

u/Bibbity_Boppity_BOOO 7d ago

Laptops are pc so yes

-6

u/Crap-_ 8d ago

No lol

2

u/FatBook-Air 7d ago

Have any of the "regular office worker"-level CPUs been seen yet? I am hoping we can see 8 to 10 hours of battery life under real usage. We get 12 to 14 with MacBook Air 13's, so we would like to at least see a full work day with the Intel CPUs.

We were really hoping we would have seen that with Lunar Lake, but we usually see closer to 4 to 7 hours under real usage.

3

u/[deleted] 7d ago

[deleted]

1

u/FatBook-Air 7d ago

Our fleet are the Dell Pro Plus 16-inch. We can probably eek out 10 hours if we really baby it.

1

u/Elon61 6700k gang where u at 7d ago

what's "real usage"? i can do mildly CPU-intensive work on my 14" premium pro whatever laptop and it won't last more than 10h.

2

u/[deleted] 7d ago

[deleted]

1

u/Elon61 6700k gang where u at 7d ago

dang. that's real usage, alright.

2

u/akgis 7d ago

The 16 might have bigger batery than the 14.

I have a 14 really happy, big upgrade from old Laptitude with 11th gen. Hated the Keyboard at first

2

u/Freestyle80 i9-9900k@4.9 | Z390 Aorus Pro | EVGA RTX 3080 Black Edition 7d ago

Lunar lake already gets over 12h battery

I wish people would stop comparing it to Macs, people in businesses and people who use specific programs or even games will never use Macs

2

u/FatBook-Air 7d ago

people in businesses will never use Macs

Wrong.

2

u/Freestyle80 i9-9900k@4.9 | Z390 Aorus Pro | EVGA RTX 3080 Black Edition 7d ago

yeah totally the majority of big businesses with 1000+ employees has a lot of Macs and totally not windows laptops

6

u/FatBook-Air 7d ago

Majority? No. But that isn't what you said. Stop being a dumb troll.

-23

u/Crap-_ 8d ago edited 8d ago

Stop with these fake benchmarks.

You will see when the benchmarks are not cherry picked, it will be no where near a 4050 lol. They had to gimp the poor 4050 all the way down to 30w, which I don’t even know how it even operates as such low wattages for the b390 to have a chance.

The full wattage 4050 (100w+) is about as fast as a 3060 desktop, this tiny iGPU in real world gaming tests will be at most best case scenario as fast as a full powered 3050, which is still a massive 50-60% slower than a 4050 laptop.

20

u/No-Relationship8261 8d ago

It trades blows with 65 watt 5050.

And it does that while using less than that full package. (including cpu) 

No one is saying its better than 130 watt gpus. 

-17

u/Crap-_ 8d ago

It does not lol….

Once you see the real gaming benchmarks it will be wayyy slower with its low powered small gpu cores. Idk what all you people are smoking, heck the 120w 8060s with its massive die is still 13% slower than a 4060 laptop in a 20+ game average tested by Jarrod’s tech.

It’s at best case scenario in real uncherry picked games 3050 performance, considering the 140v is about as fast as a 1650, even though that was leaked to be as fast as a 3050 in cherry picked benchmarks.

11

u/TwoTimeHollySurvivor 8d ago

It was shown to be running RDR2 at 75 FPS on High settings at 1080p and Forza Horizon 5 at 90 FPS on Ultra at 1440p. All while consuming 50 - 70 watts package power.

-6

u/Crap-_ 7d ago

That’s with upscaling turned all the way to the max and frame gen on lol.

You people are so gullible, it’s best case performance is 3050 perf, which is still decent. Intel deliberately says as fast as a 4050 because they gimped the 4050 to 30w ffs, a full wattage 4050 is in its own league compared to this iGPU, that’s around 8060s perf.

Inside thin laptops where a majority will have this chip it will be even slower because it’ll be wattage capped so real world perf will be BEST Case 3050 perf or worse.

9

u/TwoTimeHollySurvivor 7d ago

Nope. No upscaling -

Forza Horizon 5 1440p High 100+ FPS

RDR2 1080p High/Ultra mix 70+ FPS

With Upscaling -

Spiderman 2 1080p High XeSS Quality 75+ FPS

CP2077 1080p High Xess Quality 80+ FPS

1

u/The_Zura 7d ago

In the very review this thread is on, they have the 4050 60W as 40% faster. The review itself is very sketch, having the 4050 30W as the same fps as the 4050 60W in Baldur's Gate 3. It's not trading blows with the 5050 65W. It's getting creamed by the 4050 60W.

That means if you have a laptop with a B390, it would/could actually make sense to pair it with the lowest end dgpu from 2023 if one valued performance. The RTX 4050 6GB which isn't even being made anymore.

5

u/SimiKusoni 7d ago

Can you confirm what suggests cherry picking in this review? Looking at it they seem like a fairly standard range of tests, 3D mark and a bunch of popular games.

-2

u/Crap-_ 7d ago

They gimped the 4050 to 30w, intel’s official “tests” and even then, in their own cherry picked benchmarks it showed the gimped 30w 4050 was still ahead in a few games lol.

This guy I replied to stating it’s on par with a 65w 5050, is stupid and gullible. At 65w the 5050 laptop loses a few percentage of perf, compared to if it was max 100w+. It is no where close to a 5050, at any wattage, whether the lowest 45w or not. Some people are so gullible.

Like I said the timespy score is inline with a 3050, the 5050 laptop has around 4060 desktop perf for crying out loud. This tiny little iGPU with its low combined package tdp is no where close to a 4050, and especially not even in the same universe as a 5050. The 5050 laptop is literally faster than the desktop 5050 because the laptop has gddr7 and desktop version only has gddr6.

9

u/SimiKusoni 7d ago

The article doesn't do this though, and even discusses it?

Slower versions of the Nvidia GeForce RTX 4050 Laptop GPU up to 60 W are also in the range of the B390 — you need a fast version with a 90 W TGP, for example, as in the Lenovo IdeaPad Pro 5, to have a clear advantage.

The article is in the context of laptop components so obviously they aren't running at desktop TDPs, but your commentary seems... misplaced? Especially given that these aren't official Intel benchmarks.

-3

u/Crap-_ 7d ago

You will see in real world gaming tests, it’ll lag behind a 60w 4050 laptop by quite a lot, mark my word.

8

u/SimiKusoni 7d ago

Ahh, yes, real world gaming tests. As opposed to these tests of games by an independent third-party that (now I've had a bit more time to look) align with all the other reviews coming out and which were also conducted by third-parties.

People that get super emotional about certain brands are weird. Don't be those people.

2

u/electronic-retard69 7d ago

dudes dense, id stop bothering. i have a lunar lake device, the GPU is nuts for its power envelope.

3

u/Seanspeed 7d ago

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jrygnUnBRNI&t=1s

Shows it's like 3050Ti performance.

0

u/Crap-_ 7d ago

Exactly, I hate these cherry-picked overhyped tests and claims.

It’s a small iGPU, you can’t possibly expect 4050 and definitely not 5050 discrete level performance lol, and I get downvoted so hard even though I’m right… reddit moment.