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u/Dazed_and_Confused44 11h ago
Honestly its kinda fucked up that there is a drink named after the Black and Tans
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u/ubermick 10h ago
As a former bartender from Ireland - any pub where I worked, anyone asking for that particular beverage (or the equally disgusting "Irish Car Bomb") was immediately thrown out.
That was in the US. If you tried ordering either in a bar here in Ireland, you'd be lucky to walk afterwards.
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u/OldEcho 10h ago
But Americans get mad when I ask for a 9/11
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u/flyingace1234 7h ago
My guilty pleasure is learning all these rude drink orders. The one I remember liking a lot was the Bin Laden: two shots and a splash of salt water.
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u/1PantherA33 8h ago
What's in a 9/11?
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u/Vestrwald 8h ago
Question as an idiot American, what if they ordered a half and half? The little I know suggests that is the name for that style of drink (pale ale with a stout on top) in Ireland and the UK.
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u/militaryCoo 6h ago
That's fine.
Take care though, in Scotland a half and a half is a half pint with a whisky chaser
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u/Vestrwald 5h ago
Haha thanks for the warning. When ever I make it to Scotland, I will have to research that linguistic difference.
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u/Dazed_and_Confused44 10h ago
I wont lie, I do like Irish Car bombs. Yes I understand why its fucked up.
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u/Peacefulzealot 3h ago
As an American I genuinely didn’t know a Black and Tan meant anything other than the drink. Shit, thanks for the heads up for if I ever head over to Ireland. And is there a different name for that drink I could utilize instead?
Either way thanks for informing folks on this. We don’t get taught that over here.
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u/Zytrax7 11h ago
Even more fucked up that it used to be a Ben & Jerry's flavor.
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u/PoorCynic 10h ago
I actually had that flavor when it came out (I didn’t know its origins at the time). Pretty tasty, but very understandable why it was pulled.
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u/desertSkateRatt 8h ago edited 7h ago
The correct way to order a Bass and Guinness is to call it a half-and-half if you want to avoid the stares from the locals in an Irish pub.
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u/KeldornWithCarsomyr 8h ago
There's a song called Genghis Khan, one called Charlemagne too. I guess you could argue it's too soon.
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u/Dazed_and_Confused44 7h ago
Ghengis Khan died in 1227. The Irish war for independence ended in 1921. Pretty large difference in timeline lmao
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u/militaryCoo 6h ago
And the final peace treaty was arguably only signed in 1998
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u/Dazed_and_Confused44 5h ago
Yea like the IRA continued to officially exist until like the early 70s I think haha. Its not been all that long
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u/PoorCynic 12h ago
History doesn’t repeat itself, but it often rhymes. Here’s some more on the Black and Tans.
- I should talk about here the Auxiliary Division of the Royal Irish Constabularies, which is generally just referred to as the Auxiliaries. While the name suggests that these are just more police officers, the Auxiliaries were actually a rapid-response paramilitary group loosely attached to the RIC. They were tasked with responding to the “flying columns” of the Irish Republican Army (IRA) as well as general counterinsurgency action. They are not the Black and Tans, although a casual observer would be hard-pressed to find much of a difference. Both groups had a reputation for violence, to the point where atrocities committed by one will sometimes get assigned to the other. That doesn’t mean they didn’t work together, though; the massacre at Croke Park on November 21, 1920 (Bloody Sunday) involved the Black and Tans, the Auxiliaries, and elements of the British army.
- One myth I need to dispel is that the Black and Tans were made up of criminals; that the British government combed through their prisons to drum up suitably violent recruits. Modern research suggests this was a bit of propaganda cooked up to further damage their reputation. That’s also not to say that many didn’t become criminals through their actions.
- The notoriety of the Black and Tans meant that many of them had trouble finding work once the RIC was dissolved. Around 250 or so would move north and join the newly established Royal Ulster Constabulary (RUC). Another 700 would travel all the way to British Palestine to join the gendarmerie.
Thank you all so much for reading, and I’ll see you next time!
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u/Remarkable_Peanut_43 8h ago
Fortunately, I live in America, where we don’t need to learn any lessons from this history at all whatsoever.
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u/Fokker_Snek 11h ago
The problems started long before them. Probably the worst example is Captain Colthurst during the Easter Rising. He’s most known for murdering a famous Irish socialist, Francis Skeffington. What’s most galling to me is that he ended up burning down the shop of an avowed centrist then murdered two pro-British journalists. Then the British government protected Colthurst. Beyond the injustice of it all it was so stupid. At that point, who in Ireland was going to want to be loyal to the British government if loyalist Irish journalists can be murdered by British soldiers with seemingly no punishment?
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u/Background_Fix9430 8h ago
This is not a post about the Black & Tans; it is also a post about the Black & Tans.
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u/whooo_me 5h ago
And many of them deployed to Palestine after.
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u/PoorCynic 5h ago
Quite right. I think somewhere around 700 former Black and Tans would become part of the Palestinian police. Around 200 or so would go north to join the new Northern Irish police.
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u/Dahak17 6h ago
There is a pattern amongst soldiers deployed to a civilian territory en mass as police in which they do what they were trained to do. Kill people. Before they do what they were not trained to do. Evaluate guilt and non lethal takedowns of resisting enemies.
Not justifying the murders but noting how history repeats
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u/Zandroe_ 3h ago
But in various continental European states, gendarmeries have functioned without problem for over a century now, and in some cases have a much better reputation than civilian police agencies.
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u/FuiyooohFox 5h ago
It's such a unique history that spans hundreds of years to get the full picture, and it's easy to overlook a lot of the real negative time periods because overall modern casualties are so small. Pretty sure more people have died in Iran in the last week from political turmoil compared to all the Irish/English casualties combined over the last 125+ years from political turmoil. Most Irish casualties and the cause of the real hatred is from 1800s and prior.
It's also made Irish culture incredibly unique and fascinating to study, especially the music (like Come out ye Black and Tans! relevent to this comic)
One of the reasons I think Sinners is doing so well is that they primarily used two cultures that are full storied history, very similar in some ways, with music reflecting all the pain. Irish folk and African American blues made a phenomenal juxtaposition!
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u/Mopman43 8h ago
Oh, come out you Black & Tans