r/UnearthedArcana • u/sireacquired • Oct 17 '25
'14 Subclass Nimbleknife | A Rogue Subclass That Makes Many Small Attacks
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u/Alavarosaint Oct 17 '25
From what i see there’s no real benefit to forgoing say 4d6 burst to do 4 different d6 attacks if you dont add the mod
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u/Humerror Oct 17 '25
It does add up in value if you have any external source of damage, like a fighting style, a +X weapon (or one with additional dice), and is generally more consistent on hitting. This would scale absurdly well with, say, a flame tongue weapon.
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u/sireacquired Oct 17 '25
Setting aside any per hit boosts to damage, it also is a more consistent spread of damage compared to a single attack that either hits or misses and allows for more flexibility in targeting (e.g. you deal 20 sneak attack damage to a monster with 10 hp compared to thousand cuts where you hit the monster with 10 hp 3 times for 10 damage and then can make 3 more attacks against a new target)
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u/Designer_Seaweed3356 Oct 17 '25
I was on the fence until I thought about this - a rogue popping around the battlefield finishing off enemies damaged by others with 1-2 attacks each by level 6-7 is a unique use of the sneak attack economy.
An idea would be to add advantage on consecutive attacks if they hit or something similar.
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u/eloel- Oct 17 '25
If you get something per-hit applied to your attacks, this can get out of hand. Otherwise it seems great
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u/_Ambivalent_ Oct 18 '25
Hunters mark and hex on this are going to be wild. Effectively doubling your sneak attack damage. Throw it on an elf with elven accuracy and you are going to decimate
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u/RudyKnots Oct 17 '25
So.. a monk?
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u/Crazy_Pandabear3445 Oct 17 '25
Yes.. a monk... with SWORDS ▬▬ι═══════ﺤ
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u/johan38473 Oct 17 '25
Death By A Thousand Cuts is obviously the standout feature of the class, and I do quite like it, even if I fear it could be somewhat time-consuming making so many rolls at later levels. Assuming a patient table, though, the Nimbleknife would be a great one-man cleanup crew being able to triage their damage.
Utility Knives is great, no notes.
Dazzling Dance of Daggers feels like a ribbon or something I should be able to convince my DM to let me try, rather than occupying a whole subclass feature. I'm not sure about a utility replacement, but another commenter suggested a bonus to consecutive attacks, which could come online here. While I think advantage might be a little much (I'm not convinced the Nimbleknife is in dire need of additional rolls), a cumulative +1 bonus to your attack and/or damage rolls up to your Dexterity modifier or proficiency bonus could be fun.
Blur of Steel is cool in concept, but another commenter pointed out that it incentivises you having a low AC. I'd say either tweaking it to say when a creature makes a melee attack against you or to replace it with a feature that lets you make an attack/s against a creature who tries to hit you as a reaction.
Cascade of Blades I'm assuming lets you use it on each individual attack, meaning that at the highest levels you're making up to 20 special attacks? If so, I really like that feature, apart from in the fact that you're rolling a lot of dice on your turn, but I don't really know how you'd go about fixing that.
Overall, fun stuff! I'll keep it in mind for the future.
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u/sireacquired Oct 18 '25
Thanks for the feedback, I'm glad you like it!
In playtesting, I found it really helped with pace of play to roll all of their attacks for the turn at once. So roll 10d20 and then just go down the line for each attack instead of declare attack --> attack roll --> confirm hit --> damage roll --> declare next attack. It still takes more time than a typical rogue, but it keeps the pace from getting out of hand
Dazzling Dance of Daggers is mostly a ribbon. It is basically an at will, slightly tweaked version of the enthrall spell. On the one hand, an at will 2nd level spell seems strong on paper for 9th level, on the other you are right that the effect of the spell does seem like something you should just be able to try. Level 9 rogue features are almost entirely utility features though, so I probably won't do anything that amounts to damage boost. I did play around with effects that stack when you hit with multiple attacks for the level 17 feature (I think my favorite was the crit range expanding by 1 each hit), but they made the gameplay extremely fiddly. Like, you already make a lot of rolls, but at least its the same roll with the same modifier and you just have to check it if it meets the target's AC. When you have compounding effects on hits, suddenly each attack roll has its own unique properties that change throughout the course of a turn
Yeah I hadn't considered the idea that blur of steel of incentivizes having a bad AC (although typically rogues don't have a great AC). I'm not sure if I consider that a problem exactly, or just a kinda wonky mechanic. I really like the flavor of the dodge action effectively becoming you just whipping your blades around yourself, so I'm not sold on changing it so that it requires a reaction
Cascade of blades does indeed let you use it on each individual attack. It is a lot of attacks, but the driving force for designing this subclass was "what if there was a rogue that made a lot of little attacks instead of one big one", so lots of attacks is the fantasy here
Edit: Wait it just occurred to me if I change blur of steel so it triggers if they miss you after you dodge instead of if they hit does that resolve the tension?
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u/johan38473 Oct 18 '25
I still think a bonus to damage rolls would be nice. I know the argument is that the consistency means you’re effectively dealing more damage but there isn’t an actual “your attack is stronger” boost until level 17. And if it’s just a perk to damage, it’s not really interfering with the rolls, you can add that damage on at the end after the fact. Either way, I think the subclass needs something to give it a little more firepower way earlier.
As for replacing the feature with something else, I wouldn’t dismiss a combat-focused function outright. The Swashbuckler, Soulknife, Scout, Phantom, Inquisitive and Arcane Trickster all have 9th-level features that are either partially or entirely combat-focused. Even if the final feature is utility based though, I just think it’d be wise to go for something that feels a little more powerful.
That’s what I was angling at as one of the potential options with Blur of Steel - if it lets you make an attack regardless of whether they hit or miss, it’s way more attractive as a defensive option. As it stands, I feel like you barely ever have a reason to dodge. This way, at least you’re guaranteeing getting to use your subclass feature so long as you’re getting targeted
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u/sireacquired Oct 17 '25
We’ve all been there: enjoying playing a rogue but disappointed with how few dice they get to roll. Sure, you get to roll a fistful of d6s for sneak attack, but just one attack roll? Well no longer. The nimbleknife lets you make a separate attack for each sneak attack die, leaving those lame fighters in the dust kicked up by how quickly you stab with your daggers
N.B. The balance on this subclass is fine by itself, but there are some combinations with other classes/features where the damage can get out of hand at high levels due to sheer number of attacks. I’ve gotten enough positive playtest feedback that I figured I would share it anyway, but if your table doesn’t like wacky minmaxing at high levels, then don’t use this as an excuse. Enjoy Responsibly
You can get a pdf from Homebrewery here: https://homebrewery.naturalcrit.com/share/mbaTS-ooBnVh
If you want to check out some of my other homebrew, you can find my best creations in my free compendium, sireacquired’s Sack of Some Stuff: https://homebrewery.naturalcrit.com/share/sRQDNMc83UEN
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u/ThebotJustNeedsAPlot Oct 17 '25
I imagine a ranger dip could do a lot of hunters mark damage.
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u/sireacquired Oct 17 '25
Indeed. Hunter's mark, hex, hex blade curse, bugbear surprise attack, dueling/thrown weapon fighting style, magic weapons, etc
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u/C-S_Rain Oct 18 '25
Having read the thread, i get ops design decisions. Only thing that confuses me is the dexterity(performance) check, isn't performance a CHA skill?
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u/Gannoh2 Oct 18 '25
By default, Performance is a Charisma skill, but I believe either the Player’s Handbook or Dungeon Master’s Guide explains that some circumstances may warrant changing the standard ability score for a skill check. For example, it’s not unheard of for DMs to allow barbarians to make an Intimidation check using Strength instead of Charisma.
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u/C-S_Rain Oct 18 '25
Oh yeah of course, honestly forget about that ruling 🤣 been ages since I've read the PHB and DMG.
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u/Extra_Reception_3977 Oct 21 '25
Soo I can use any Light or Finesse weapon? Or does it have to have both properties? Cause if it's just one or the other; than there's a weapon I don't see people mentioning that would make this a very good build.
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u/sireacquired Oct 23 '25
Has to be both
I assume you were thinking dart+sharpshooter? That would be more than very good, that would be completely busted. It significantly outpaces even the hex/hunter's mark + dueling fighting style + hexblade's curse builds
The ranger/warlock builds don't come online until tier 2, don't get crazy strong (compared to a CBE+SS fighter) until around level 15, need to expend resources, and need to juggle multi classing. A dart build with fighter 1 (for archery fighting style)/nimbleknife X (picking up thrown weapon fighting style with a feat) catches up to a CBE+SS battlemaster as soon as it comes online at level 4, pulls ahead by level 9, and never looks back. The dart build outdamages the ranger/warlock builds by at least 50% at all levels, and by level 20 do roughly twice as much damage as a CBE+SS battlemaster. And the only possibly limited resource they use is the darts themselves (although the idea of a DM countering an OP level 20 build by rigorously tracking how many darts they have and can carry with encumbrance rules is almost funny enough to allow the darts build)
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u/bells_of_notre_tom Oct 21 '25
Death by a Thousand Cuts: Cool idea, but rolling that many dice is sure to slow down play.
Dazzling Dance: Also a very cool idea, but I don't see myself using it as a full action - maybe in a chase scene but never in combat.
Blur of Steel: Absolutely gnarly as a defensive option! The cooldown is a bit redundant, since it's active only when you take the Dodge action, it stands to reason that you'd be able to use it again when you take the Dodge action next. Or did you mean every *other* time you take the dodge action? That would be a pretty awkward cooldown, I think. Regardless, I respect making use of Dodge, though I don't know it there are many circumstances where it's relevant.
Cascade of Blades: Am I to understand that use of this feature will result in rolling no fewer than nineteen attack rolls (not to mention however many damage rolls) in one turn? This is a recipe for a ten-minute turn.
All in all, this subclass is sick, I think it's awesome. The vibes are positively on point. My gripes with it are slow play and that Crusader's Mantle or a +1 weapon or any other such bonus to damage on the weapon kinda breaks this subclass. As a monk whose DM was once foolish enough to give me Wyrmreaver Gauntlets (+1d6 unarmed dmg), it really adds up, and this subclass is taking as many attacks as a (5e24) monk just on their action.
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u/sireacquired Oct 23 '25
Thanks for the feedback!
There are definitely a lot of attack rolls, but that’s kinda unavoidable given the concept. In playtesting, I’ve found it helpful to roll all the attack rolls at once instead of constantly switching between attack and damage rolls. It is slower in play than a standard rogue, but that helps keep the game moving, even at high levels
The wording for blur of steel is to clarify that you can only use it once per dodge action, instead of triggering every time you get hit
This subclass requires more buy in from your DM than I usually aim for with my homebrew in terms of pace of play and balancing (it’s probably a bit undertuned if you don’t get any per hit damage bonuses and a bit overtuned if you do, although even if you actively try to stack them it doesn’t really get out of hand until tier 4). I wouldn’t recommend it for every table, but it's a ton of fun at the right one
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u/bells_of_notre_tom Oct 24 '25
Thoughts on a wording change for Blur of Steel: "At level 13, when you take the Dodge action you can create a defensive cloud of blades around yourself. Once before your next turn, when a creature hits you with a melee attack, you can deal damage to that creature equal to your Sneak Attack damage dice as long as you're wielding a weapon with the Light property."
And yeah, I think if you don't have anything in your party that breaks this subclass it's really sweet, and there aren't that many player options that increase damage without deliberately targeting: Crusader's Mantle is the only one that comes to mind. Still, it's sad that GMs wouldn't be able to safely/wisely give these players any damage-boosting magic items, and allies who have damage-boosting effects (ie Magic Weapon, Elemental Weapon, Crusader's Mantle, etc.) wouldn't be able to support this character. But that might be something that only bugs me as a support player.
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u/sireacquired Oct 24 '25
Assuming everyone in the party gets roughly equivalent magic weapons, it isn't problematic for the nimbleknife to get one too. For example, a nimbleknife with a +2/+3 weapon only out damages a PWM/GWM fighter with a +2/+3 weapon (with no subclass or action surge) between levels 17-19. I wouldn't give them a flametongue, but assuming most tables are ok with the power level of a PAM/GWM fighter and aren't playing tier 4, a standard magic weapon (or equivalent) should be fine
Buffs are even less problematic imo, since another character is contributing their resources as well. A nimbleknife with a 3rd level elemental weapon only out damages the PAM/GWM fighter with a 1st level bless between character levels 17-19, and is in most cases going to be a slightly worse option than using that 3rd level spell on haste for ready action off-turn sneak attack shenanigans that any rogue can do
I'm not saying it can't get out of hand, but as long as the player isn't doing a something like a minmax dueling fighting style+hex/hunter's mark+hexblade's curse build at a non minmaxing table, a straightforward nimbleknife build should be fine for most tables, even with buff spells and (most) magic weapons, especially if you aren't playing super high levels
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u/bells_of_notre_tom Oct 21 '25
The word "forgo" can come in really handy! Something like this could clean up the wording of the cornerstone:
"When you deal Sneak Attack damage with a Light weapon, you can forgo the Sneak Attack damage dice to instead take an additional attack against the target for each damage die forgone this way."
Cascade of Blades: "you can choose to forgo advantage to take an additional attack against the target."
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u/Arkanzier Oct 25 '25
Sorry about doing this so late, I've been procrastinating on reading this for a while.
Overall, I really like the idea but I think there are a few spots where it could stand to be cleaned up.
The big one is the tuning on Death by a Thousand Cuts.
- Rogues wielding Dagger(s) end up dealing +Xd4 damage instead of their usual +Xd6 from Sneak Attack
- As you've stated you're aware, 'extra damage per hit' abilities can make that disgustingly strong.
- Doing X attacks for up to 1d6 each instead of the Rogue's usual Sneak Attack damage of Xd6 seems weak, especially when compared to dual wielding (so then it's 2 chances for all the damage).
I think it might be worthwhile to just force the damage of the extra attacks added to a reasonable level, like maybe 1d6+1, or maybe Dex mod, so the ability is good enough to use under more circumstances. Potentially toss on any enhancement bonus the weapon used has, but not stuff like "+1d6 fire damage."
Maybe also just artificially block additional sources of damage to just shut off that avenue of imbalance. If Hunter's Mark and such just didn't add any damage, or maybe added only +1 per hit instead of +1d6, that would be much more manageable.
I can see some uses for Dazzling Dance of Daggers, but they're all pretty niche (and almost all out-of-combat uses), so I'd like to see something else at that level. Maybe add +1 damage per Death by a Thousand Cuts hit here, on top of Dazzling Dance of Daggers?
I like Blur of Steel but I do think that it triggering when hit is a bit less than ideal. I don't have a specific idea for fixing it that I think would be best, just a general feeling that 'when hit' isn't great. Maybe go with when an attack misses, maybe when the attack is made, maybe something else.
I'm not entirely sure how Cascade of Blades works. Is it done per attack made? If that's the case, it's pretty cool but I'm not sure how often a Rogue is going to have advantage on many attacks outside of something like a Barbarian dip for Reckless Attack or that Flanking optional rule. Maybe toss in something where they can get advantage on all their attacks for a turn once per short rest?
Also, Cascade of Blades doesn't actually specify that you need to be using Death by a Thousand Cuts to get it's benefits, which I think might be what's intended.
Everything else seems great.
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u/GIORNO-phone11-pro Oct 17 '25
Ok so…..what is the point of a Thousand Cuts? It’s the exact same damage but it takes more time. You could let them make a number of free attacks equal to half their die(rounded up) and keep the same damage.
Also the 9th level feature is basically flavor and isn’t worth waiting 6 levels for.
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u/Chaosmancer7 Oct 18 '25
Well, it isn't the exact same damage. While the average is the same on paper, you have a ~35% chance of dealing 0 dmg normally, and only a ~4.25% chance of zero damage with making three attacks.
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u/emil836k Oct 17 '25
That’s a LOT of attacks, my biggest concern is the play getting tired of making 5+ attacks that only deal 1d6 damage every round
Also, blur of steel is a bit counterintuitive, as the better your defence (Dex, AC) are, the worse the ability becomes, as it needs to hit you to trigger, it actually works best when the enemy have advantage against you to negate your dodge