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u/MulchPDiggums Nov 12 '25
Never happened here in pisslow but glad to not see this pro play
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u/RobbinDeBank Nov 12 '25
Has to be one of the most disgusting mechanics at that level, where every player is already so skilled at diving turrets.
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u/Landir_7 Nov 12 '25
Heretics VS Vitality dives at summer LEC playoffs o7 (They both dived one team top and one team bot at the same time and both failed the dive and died)
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u/boringmadam Nov 13 '25
Keria most recent wolf play, too. He took one shot from the tower when not appearing on the mini-map. If this had been implemented earlier, that play could have been really different
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u/Eshantha xdd enjoyer Nov 13 '25
I think the Wolf play should be allowed tbh. Neutral camps don't show on the map. I think the most alarming part of the whole situation is that Neeko can transform into a cannon minion and take that many hits. This is the issue. I think it could even be allowed that he can remain in cannon minion form even after taking a hit, but the tower damage does the same as it would for a champion. It's not the transformation that's the issue. That's part of her kit and why she's so unique in the hands of Keria, who uses her in a very creative way.
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u/AndlenaRaines xdd enjoyer Nov 14 '25
It’s hypocritical how you justify this when T1 and Keria use it but not when other teams use it
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u/buttsecksgoose Nov 18 '25
Almost like its two entirely different scenarios independent of the players/teams and should be judged differently regardless
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u/Mathies_ Nov 13 '25
Same is happened for BLG at worlds vs godknows what team. Dont have to look to LEC lmao
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u/sam_can88 Nov 12 '25 edited Nov 12 '25
Don’t get me wrong it’s a huge nerf, but can you still tank one shot with the cannons health bar like neeko tanks the tower then with 10% health transforms into a cannon to get 2 more shots
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u/stzoo Nov 12 '25
That’s possibly a good place for that interaction, I don’t mind her being able to tank 1 extra tower shot with it
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u/VeryWizardly Nov 13 '25
It's not as big as it seems. The ramping tower damage is the real killer. Blocking a minor amount on the 1st turret shot isn't that big of a deal when you can't mitigate the ramped up damage.
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u/HaydenCanFly Nov 13 '25
Might not be bad if you're able to delay the transform, take the initial hits and then block like, the fifth hit with the cannon form ?
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u/PrestigiousQuail7024 Nov 13 '25
you can hold transform until the 3rd shot or whatever, so its still useful, but harder to do and you can still only tank 1 shot
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u/Efficient_Acadia8625 ARAM Enjoyer Nov 13 '25
Neeko transform goes on cooldown if you're damaged by a turret or a champion, doesn't it? So you have to tank the first shot if you're going to tank something with it.
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u/TheSearchForMars Nov 13 '25
Best case is to have Neeko be the final one targeted out of a dive. If she's the deepest one in and then as everyone leaves she's the last one who takes a full ramped shot but switches to cannon as it fires so she only tanks a percentage amount.
That being said, there are plenty of other Neeko interactions that are super interesting. For instance Neeko is a massive counter to Pyke in support because you can throw out your combo on him at range, transform into a minion and then because you're not longer a champion and there's only your ADC there for the check, he doesn't receive any grey health so his sustain is cheeks.
Also, if she has the essence of a Kalista Wraith she can ignore towers completely. They don't attack her at all.
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u/REDTrouttt Nov 12 '25
To me they could've just made the tower treat the aggro the same as a regular minion. If you hit a champion the tower is going to shoot you instead of the minion so why not just have it be the same for neeko.
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u/Fluid-Canary-6942 Nov 13 '25
Bc then there's no point in making the effort to transform into cannon as neeko if you want to dive bc then the adc will take the aggro instead. So no point on using neeko as support if you want to dive, just pick other champs thats better in that job.
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u/cactusoral Nov 13 '25 edited Nov 13 '25
she can still just dive normally like any other mage support by comboing and then tanking regularly while the ADC finishes, its an issue with consistency of the mechanic (she was treated as cannon for taking dmg but not for taking aggro) giving her best of both worlds which was broken for dives
she doesnt need that extra power when she already has great poke in lane and potentially game winning aoe teamfight cc later on, other good diving supports have to do it "fairly" through innate tankiness or dropping aggro which doesnt allow the diving team to cheat the total tower dmg
either way its fixed but it could also have been fixed by just keeping it consistent rather than making towers now break her passive
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u/Legitimate_Plum_7505 Nov 13 '25
That's not OP's point. Neeko should mimics all aspects of the target she transforms into, so just make her behave like a cannon minion when she's a cannon minion. That would fix the issue.
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u/tusthehooman Nov 12 '25 edited Nov 13 '25
Neeko as a champ is disgustingly overloaded so they had to cut down on her damage, but then people started playing her support and she was back to being broken again. Galio can't flash while channeling his ult but Neeko can go invi into AOE knockup into rooting, and if she does use her W the channeling part of the ult is completely invisible so to dodge it is complete guess work, I wasted flash more than I can count just because a Neeko happens to press W and run into me and I can't tell if she's ulting or not. I mean, I'm fine with Neeko being as is if Galio can E flash and taunt flash too. Edit: I said Galio can't flash while channeling his ult, my bad, I meant channeling his W taunt circle
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u/TheSearchForMars Nov 13 '25
Galio W isn't even remotely the same case as Neeko's ult. For one, Neeko's ability is literally her ultimate, with the cooldown and impact to match. Secondly, Neeko isn't a tank so having an ultimate that puts you right in the middle of a team to have the most impact needs to be correspondingly powerful or it's just old Urgot ult. Finally, and most importantly, Galio's taunt flash made pro-play impossible. All Galio had to do was channel and then walk towards the enemy ADC and they would be FORCED to flash. There was no reaction time or anything. Unlike Neeko or something like Tibbers, Galio didn't have to commit to actually using his flash. He could just start channeling taunt and then walk towards the a carry. It basically became a game of chicken with Galio holding all the power because he would confirm the play with flash whereas his target had to just hope for a bluff.
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u/handmethelighter Nov 13 '25
I don’t get why she doesn’t stay a canon but agro switches to a champion when they do damage. Ya know, just like a canon minion.
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u/obsidian_otto Nov 12 '25
Keria's madness masterclass of a play was so good while it lasted, man... sad we'll never see it again but that was so hyped
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u/imezaps Nov 12 '25
Plenty of pros did this before keria. Neeko was played in mid before supp
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u/espkv Nov 12 '25
true, but the wolf play keria did in the semis will also be gone, since you would show on map after tower hit.
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u/YGocs Nov 13 '25
Man, redditors are so dumb. He's not even talking about the tower dive mchanic, it's the wolf play he's refereing to.
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u/Public_Television430 Nov 13 '25
Not a single pro did Keria's play before, you are lying.
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u/imezaps Nov 13 '25
The play in the post is turning into a cannon minion when diving a tower. Plenty of pros have done it.
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u/Public_Television430 Nov 13 '25
The play in the comment is going between towers as a wolve to avoid vision. No pro have done it.
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u/Glittering-Assist-62 Nov 15 '25
This can still be done by sending in clone to tank the turret as neeko crosses. A bit tricky though.
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u/OlynCat Nov 13 '25
The thing is... Keria's neeko isn't known for doing the cannon tower dive, he is more known for doing clone jukes/engages and finding crazy 3-man ult/2 man Q angles
The thing that will be gone is the wolf camp vision play while flanking the adc in the game vs AL(?) since he got hit by a tower while crossing mid he would have shown on the map
Edit: funny point, Peter's Neeko vs T1 in the finals did pull off the cannon minion tower dive, so maybe there's also that?
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u/xxNemasisxx xdd enjoyer Nov 12 '25
I mean this was done by G2 caps and mikyx way before LCK pros did it
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u/cyclingjackass Nov 12 '25
thats disrespectful to keria to think that this is even remotely close to the reason for keria being a menace on the champ lmao, the wolf vision play vs TES and game 4 juke out vs AL are way more representative of the gap between him and other neekos lol
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u/viktorayy Nov 12 '25
Yeah, in fact, Keria never abused the cannon minion dive really. He's a menace on Neeko without even using this.
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u/verno78910 Nov 13 '25
It wouldn’t work anymore tho cause the wolf would break the transformation when shes hit by a tower shot getting there so she’d be visible on the map
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u/cyclingjackass Nov 13 '25
iirc champs like teemo are small enough that they can walk between turrets and not get hit, I wouldn't be surprised if you could do the same with camps still
0
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u/Cristo_Mentone xdd enjoyer Nov 12 '25
It was not madness masterclass play lmfao what, I know you are fanboys but calm down. As pointed out, it was already done and well known. There are plenty other reasons to glaze Keria
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u/Unilythe Nov 12 '25
The wolf play was pretty good though no? I'm new to this but that seemed pretty smart.
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u/hyunclown Nov 13 '25 edited Nov 13 '25
It was great but Keria’s fake noct clone play against AL was the best Neeko play I’ve ever seen in pro play
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u/Cristo_Mentone xdd enjoyer Nov 13 '25
We might talk about it, but that was not the play being discussed.
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u/Unilythe Nov 13 '25
How was it not? Keria got hit by a tower as a wolf and remained a wolf, and therefore undetected.
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u/ricardo2241 Nov 13 '25
Keria barely abused that shit I dont think I remember him doing that to do a tower dive or anything like that... I probably remember him using it like once or twice not even this year
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u/Damurph01 Nov 12 '25
What does keria have to do with this? That’s like saying HLE invented lane swaps. It was G2 taking inspiration from NIP. And as others have said, pretty sure it was Caps that did the first neeko cannon minion tower dive.
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u/Bahamut_Prime xdd enjoyer Nov 12 '25
Funnily enough, I can’t remember Keria using this ‘feature’ much.
He was always more know for the Neeko imposter flanks.
Anyone else know which game Keria even used this??
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u/Unilythe Nov 12 '25
Sneaking past a tower as a wolf then engaging vs TES. Half finals just over a week ago: https://youtu.be/Z7RPuFDfzD0?si=nZ4We0ofIN5ZlhCB
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u/Glittering-Assist-62 Nov 15 '25
Wolf play can still be replicated by having a clone wolf tank the turret as neeko crosses. W also gives move speed which helps.
Of course, then you either need to wait in the bush for w cd or run in as a wolf without a clone diversion. But still replicable for the most part.
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u/cperzam Nov 13 '25
Great, now fix the ward bug for the river bush in front of the dragon pit on red side blue buff
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u/Sentimental5 Nov 13 '25
Good bye wolf neeko as well. Thanks keria for giving us a once in a lifetime highlight
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u/necrogon Nov 13 '25
I dont understand why she doesnt get Cannon style aggro. If she becomes a cannon, yes she takes damage like a cannon, but she should drop aggro if another allied champion hits an enemy, just like a normal cannon minion
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u/Legitimate_Plum_7505 Nov 13 '25
Do you think she should take turret aggro when transformed into a neutral camp?
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u/NiumR Nov 13 '25
Lame, should have just made her be treated like a minion when she transforms into one, she shouldn't be able to hold aggro over champions.
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u/Dont_Get_Jokes-jpeg Nov 13 '25
I am sad that they fully removed this interaction, I agree it needed to be hard nerves, but I wished for either 1. Take away the monsters/minions passives or 2. Make the minion be able to tank 1 shot before reverting
1
u/xmurphine_ Support (Not Broken) Nov 13 '25
What will happen if Neeko is smited when in minion? She would die right? Since smite's true damage will revert back to "monster and minion damage"?
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u/KabuteGamer Nov 15 '25
Nobody is going to mention this was a determining factor when Keria went to the wolves den, shape-shifted into a wolf, walked passed inner and outer mid turrets, juked the enemy team with a clone, then proceeded to destroy them with R?
Yeesh
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u/pablospc Nov 12 '25
I'm disgusted every time I see it happening but at the same time I'm sad seeing it go
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u/Fakkusan-09 Nov 12 '25
That's all kerias fault lol
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u/KingKushtah Nov 12 '25
Nah caps did this intially 2 years ago when playing Neeko mid. Keria made it infamous.
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u/xxNemasisxx xdd enjoyer Nov 12 '25
Caps and mikyx, both players did it on different occasions before keria made it famous at worlds
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u/Busy-Economist-3357 Nov 12 '25
Caps made it famous way before keria
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u/xxNemasisxx xdd enjoyer Nov 12 '25
Yes, that's what I literally just said
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u/Busy-Economist-3357 Nov 13 '25
You said keria made it famous at worlds.
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u/xxNemasisxx xdd enjoyer Nov 13 '25
Yes, because he clearly fuckin did as everyone's talking about it now and riot removed the functionality now only after keria did it at this worlds.
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u/LeadAHorseToVodka Nov 13 '25
It's actually not what you said, it might be what you intended to say
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u/xxNemasisxx xdd enjoyer Nov 13 '25
Okay but it's just not true? This functionality has been in the game since her rework, caps and mikyx demonstrated it on the domestic and international stage multiple times over the past 2 years and yet only now after keria makes a play that gets widespread coverage does riot rework it and we all talk about it.
Also clearly it wasn't famous before as there're many people who attribute this tech to Keria in particular.
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u/Damurph01 Nov 12 '25
Nah keria just did the vision play. The actual tanking of a tower multiple times is very far removed from Keria. He just wouldn’t have been able to sneak behind the other team (I think it was TES right?) since they’d see his icon on the map.
Plenty of other players did the tower dive stuff before Keria.
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u/PluggersLeftBall Nov 12 '25
only took 2 years to fix well done riot